Should you use a registry cleaner?

Digerati · Dec 31, 2013

While I happen to be a rare breed among my colleagues as a proponent of judicious use of Registry cleaners (well, CCleaner's Registry cleaner anyway - the only one I use and recommend), I believe they are best used as preventative maintenance tools and not to fix a broken Windows. And never without backing up the Registry first. I am a proponent because I don't see any evidence that Registry cleaners are the malicious beast they are made out to be. 10-15 years ago, maybe. But the established Registry cleaners of today and their developers have come a long way since then. But to reiterate, they should not be used to fix a broken Windows as they can make matters worse, if not careful.

I do NOT recommend downloading or using drivers from the component makers - instead, use only the motherboard maker's drivers. This is because motherboard makers frequently tweak the components (and their drivers) they integrate onto their boards.

Network cards (including integrated) are not very robust. If an electrical anomaly appears on the Ethernet cable, it can easily destroy the card (or integrated device), and they are not physically very robust either. I would do 4 things:

1. If integrated (and it likely is) I would ensure it is enabled in the BIOS Setup Menu
2. Replace the Ethernet cable. They are even less robust than the cards and can only take so many yanks and trip overs.
3. Change router ports. Router ports do go bad. I have a 3-port Linksys (formally a 4-port) router and a 6-port Netgear (formally an 8-port) router here. Routers still work fine, the integrated switches have the failed ports.
4. If none of the above work - disable the integrated in the BIOS and install a new card. They are almost dirt cheap: 10/100/1000Mbit Ethernet Card for $8.26 (with free shipping).

niemiro · Dec 31, 2013

Re: Vista Hardware Driver Removal

Digerati said:
While I happen to be a rare breed among my colleagues as a proponent of judicious use of Registry cleaners (well, CCleaner's Registry cleaner anyway - the only one I use and recommend), I believe they are best used as preventative maintenance tools and not to fix a broken Windows. And never without backing up the Registry first. I am a proponent because I don't see any evidence that Registry cleaners are the malicious beast they are made out to be. 10-15 years ago, maybe. But the established Registry cleaners of today and their developers have come a long way since then. But to reiterate, they should not be used to fix a broken Windows as they can make matters worse, if not careful.

That is an interesting point of view, and I do agree with parts of it, but not all. I would agree that registry cleaners aren't perhaps what they are always made out to be, but I've seen too many computers where I can definitively pin down registry cleaners as the cause of a particular problem.I have on multiple occasions worked with users before and after a System Restore/whatever to collect logfiles and registry hives from before and after the registry clean to see whether it was really the problem. I know there is a tendency to blame any problem on a registry cleaner, but I have still seen >10 problems (which is a lot given how hard is to prove the cause of a problem) where I am completely and 100% confident it was the registry cleaner at fault. The worst I've seen are as follows:

1x all registry hives mangled and computer completely unbootable and unrepairable (backups made were incremental and consequently useless) - small name registry cleaner I'd never heard of before.
many cases of NTREGOPT registry defrag leaving the computer working, but horrendously slow (even lag on the mouse). Still never worked out what's going on there, but it's happened far too many times.
1x case of UniBlue registry cleaner rendering computer unbootable after "cleaning" registry references to non-present (supposedly) drivers.
1x case of CCleaner registry cleaner (yes, actually CCleaner) rendering a computer virtually unusable when it corrupted some registry references to C:\Windows\Installer - could start virtually no programs.

I would contest the fact that they are safe for everyday use, and I would contest the recommendation for CCleaner (in fact, I don't even like the file system part of it as it isn't as effective as Old Timer's TFC (give it a try AFTER running a CCleaner clean and then tell me which is better) and removes logfiles, minidumps, cookies, etc., if memory serves, none of which should be removed IMO)

Richard

Digerati · Dec 31, 2013

Re: Vista Hardware Driver Removal

I don't even like the file system part of it as it isn't as effective as Old Timer's TFC

I think you illustrate a perception problem here - and that is your definition of "better".

NO DOUBT TFC (which is also on my recommended list of clutter cleaners) is "better" at removing more crud. But does that make a "better" cleaner? Or more importantly, a safer product? I say no! In fact, I say it is not "better" because TFC is a VERY AGGRESSIVE cleaner, by design - with virtually no user options. CCleaner, for example, lets me pick and choose which cookies I want to keep or delete. This is MUCH BETTER because I can clean my system of clutter, but still log in to all my regular stops without having to enter all my log-in credentials again.

Also, as noted here, TFC will not clean URL history, prefetch, or cookies and TFC requires a reboot immediately after running. I find the fact TFC forces an immediate reboot as a real minus.

Plus, I don't see what CCleaner's file cleaner has to do with this discussion. I worry that some biases are getting in the way there!

"1" case of CCleaner causing problems does not justify condemning it forever. I note millions and millions of users use it every day with no problems.

Also, a common mistake (and it is a mistake, IMO) is lumping all Registry cleaners into the same pile. That is hardly fair. Piriform and CCleaner have been around for many years. If CCleaner were as bad as you make it out to be, would they still be in business? Would experts recommend their other products (Speccy, Defraggler or Recuva) if their flagship, CCleaner, had a bad reputation or was so dangerous? No!

I like CCleaner's file and Registry cleaners BECAUSE they are NOT overly aggressive, and that, IMO, makes them "better" (that said, you can make CCleaner's file cleaner very aggressive with selected options).

Is Comodo a dangerous, rogue untrustworthy company that makes malicious products? No! They are highly regarded security program maker that also happens to make a reliable Registry cleaner too.

I would ask, have you ever had a malware scanner remove a critical file? Have you ever had a disk diagnostics make a disk unreadable? Haver you ever had a Windows or driver update break a computer? Did you condemn those products forever?

I say again, Registry cleaners should not be used to fix a broken computer. As an IT consultant and hardware technician for many years, I regularly install and uninstall all sorts of applications, various hardware devices and associated drivers. But sadly, program (and driver) developers are NOTORIOUS for lazy programming of their uninstall routines and these processes regularly leave files, folders, shortcuts, and registry entries behind. Regular "preventative" maintenance with a "good" Registry cleaner can help keep the Registry "tidy" and system boot times respectable.

Don't believe me? I recommend you check out Fred Langa's study, Putting Registry System Cleanup Apps to the Test. Fred's study is significant because he did it with Windows 7, and it answers many common questions.

Fred Langa said:
My sole point was to see whether the general principles of system and Registry cleaning deliver quantifiable, measurable improvements to Windows 7. Do specialized cleanup tools really let you remove more junk than Windows 7′s own built-in tools? Do system and Registry cleanups provide any real-life, practical benefits, such as faster boot times?

Fred is a highly regarded IT journalist (former editor of Byte Magazine and more) Note, like me, he is not saying Registry cleaners are for everyone. But he is not condemning them either.

Fred Langa said:
These results make it clear that Windows 7 can indeed benefit from use of cleanup tools!
the bottom line is this: I’ll continue using - and recommending - lightweight tools (such as command-line cleanmgr and CCleaner)

****

(...removes logfiles, minidumps, cookies, etc., if memory serves, none of which should be removed IMO)

Huh? Why not? I sure don't want 3 year old log files or minidumps on my system. And I don't want potentially 1000s of outdated cookies on my system either. But note this is a file cleaner issue - and should not be confused with cleaning the Registry.

niemiro · Dec 31, 2013

Re: Vista Hardware Driver Removal

Digerati said:
Don't believe me? I recommend you check out Fred Langa's study, Putting Registry System Cleanup Apps to the Test. Fred's study is significant because he did it with Windows 7, and it answers many common questions.

Please view a Google Search for "Should I use a registry cleaner?": https://www.google.co.uk/#q=should+I+use+a+registry+cleaner

Let's go through each result one at a time:

1. Should I use a Registry Cleaner?

PC Pitstop began more than 10 years ago by giving you the tools to keep your pc running great. We provided the Free PC Pitstop Full Test and pointed out the weaknesses and strong points of your system. Today we’re still doing the same thing and now you can have it all done for you. PC Matic is not a registry cleaner. It removes a limited and specific number of broken registry entries and makes specific and limited changes and tweaks. Don’t fall into the bad habit of using a devoted registry wrecker. Each time you do you are a little closer to a system crash.

This one's a bit dodgy. It's pushing hard its own product, and advises against other people's products. I don't think it's really a very fair study, but I'll give you the point for this because it does recommend the limited use of registry cleaners.

2. Using Registry Cleaner: Does Is It Really Make A Difference?

Registry cleaners offer no perceptible increase in performance.
Registry cleaners can break things.
Even if registry cleaners don’t break anything, using one wastes your valuable time and (perhaps) money.

Advises against registry cleaners.

3. Frequently Asked Questions About Registry Cleaners

"Do I need to run a registry cleaner on a regular basis?"No.

In case you missed that, the answer again is: No.

Contrary to the online advertising pitches, the bad information from your neighbor, and perhaps your own belief prior to this moment, registry cleaning is NOT a computer maintenance task. I can not be more clear on this topic.

...

"But cleaning my registry speeds up my computer, right?"
Wrong. See the last few paragraphs in the previous question.

"OK, maybe registry cleaning is overrated. But what's wrong with running one every day/week/month/year, just in case?"
A few reasons come to mind:

Letting an automated tool remove registry keys, especially ones not really causing problems, is risky.

It's a waste of your time.

It's a waste of your computer's resources

Actually, I'd go beyond overrated and say unnecessary. Why would you want to do any sort of maintenance that's unnecessary?

...

[However]
Registry cleaners can be useful tools to solve certain kinds of problems in the registry, like those created when a program doesn't uninstall correctly or a malware infection isn't cleaned up properly.

So registry cleaning in a very limited way.

4. Are Registry Cleaners Safe to Use? - Chris Pirillo

Read the whole of that article. I read the one you linked to, so please read this one for me.

I hope everyone will take the time to ponder what she’s written, and even add your own thoughts to the mix. If you’re using something like CCleaner to clean out your temporary files – STOP IT NOW. There are some excellent free alternatives that are much safer for your machine – such as ATF Cleaner or even TFC. Both are very safe, and very effective.

5. Do I need a Windows registry cleaner?

Although these utilities can make the Windows Registry clean, the overall potential benefits are greatly outweighed by the potential harm a they could cause. We suggest users do not install or use Windows Registry cleaners on their Windows computers.

6. What's the Registry, Should I Clean It, and What's the Point?

The internets are chock full of advertisements and testimonials for registry cleaning products that claim to fix every problem on your PC by giving your registry a good scrubbing; readers may even remember an unofficial Microsoft-supplied utility called regclean from years back, which gives even more validity to the idea that registry cleaning is a very useful pursuit. But do they really work?

The sad answer, which we covered while debunking performance tweaking myths, is that most of these products are not worth running, and while the better ones won't necessarily kill your PC, they're rarely going to help you a lot either. If you stop and think about it, you'll realize that since the registry contains many hundreds of thousands of keys (or more), removing 50 or even 100 of them isn't going to yield any performance gains.

Windows expert Ed Bott has some stronger words on the subject:
"I'd go a step further: Don't run registry cleaner programs, period. I won't go so far as to call them snake oil, but what possible performance benefits can you get from "cleaning up" unneeded registry entries and eliminating a few stray DLL files?"

That said, there are a few edge cases where cleaning the registry might yield some performance gains, if you've installed something that plugs into Windows somehow, doesn't work very well, and also doesn't uninstall itself properly. Most of these problems can be prevented in the first place by simply being more careful about what you install on your PC—after all, you shouldn't have to reinstall Windows regularly.

If you disagree with my assessment, I'd like to issue you this challenge: Before calling me out, why don't you be the first person to ever have real-world benchmarks proving that registry cleaners make a substantial difference in your system performance. I won't hold my breath

7. What You Should Know Before Using Registry Cleaner Software - TopTenREVIEWS

Overall, the decision is up to you, but when you are determining whether registry cleaner software is right for your computer, there are several different aspects you must consider before you make a decision.

If you are serious about cleaning your registry, investing in a solid registry cleaner application may be well worth it since you will avoid the hassle of a slow computer or a botched attempt at a manual registry overhaul.

So pretty much for registry cleaners.

8. Why you should use a registry cleaner? « Email large files and send large files

Run a registry cleaner at least once a month and your PC will stay fast and error-free.

The whole thing's in love with registry cleaners.

9. Does windows 7 have its own registry cleaner?

>"The reason is that as registry gets bigger, it slows PC down."

Sorry, but that's completely incorrect. The size of the registry has
no effect on the computer's speed.

Registry cleaning programs are *all* snake oil. Cleaning of the
registry isn't needed and is dangerous. Leave the registry alone and
don't use any registry cleaner. Despite what many people think, and
what vendors of registry cleaning software try to convince you of,
having unused registry entries doesn't really hurt you.

The risk of a serious problem caused by a registry cleaner erroneously
removing an entry you need is far greater than any potential benefit
it may have.

Read Why I don?t use registry cleaners | Ed Bott

Never use Registry cleaners! The size of the registry has NO impact of the PC performance!

Registry Cleaners can have positive performance results in Windows XP and older systems as far as boot time is concerned. The reason for this is that Windows will load the registry (including invalid or unused keys). Registry cleaners typically remove invalid or unused keys. This can improve boot time.

Windows 7 however, skips over invalid or unused registry keys during boot, so registry cleaners will generally have no effect. In this condition, the MVP and Moderator are correct.

That being said, most Registry Cleaner programs offer other packaged tools that can improve system performance. Tools such as disk cleanup, disk defragmentation, Windows services modification tools, startup program management, or other registry tweaks to reduce system resource usage in Windows (generally taking out bells and whistles in order to improve performance). Hence, Tim's assessment of performance increase may be due to one of such packaged tools.

Risk in return for no benefit. A bad bargain.

etc. etc.

Please, I beseech you, do not be blind to the evidence before you. 6/9 were vehemently against registry cleaners, giving a large variety of reasons. As for the remaining three, one claimed that all registry cleaners were bad...apart from their own limited and safe registry cleaner, and the other two were not exactly unbiased, but that is MY OPINION NOT HARD FACT so must be treated as such.

And please, do not call my unbiased or wilfully blind without first considering the evidence I have placed before you. And reading the whole of article #4 (see description above)

Digerati said:
I think you illustrate a perception problem here - and that is your definition of "better".

NO DOUBT TFC (which is also on my recommended list of clutter cleaners) is "better" at removing more crud. But does that make a "better" cleaner? Or more importantly, a safer product? I say no! In fact, I say it is not "better" because TFC is a VERY AGGRESSIVE cleaner, by design - with virtually no user options. CCleaner, for example, lets me pick and choose which cookies I want to keep or delete. This is MUCH BETTER because I can clean my system of clutter, but still log in to all my regular stops without having to enter all my log-in credentials again.

Also, as noted here, TFC will not clean URL history, prefetch, or cookies and TFC requires a reboot immediately after running. I find the fact TFC forces an immediate reboot as a real minus.

No, I stick by what I said. I would not call CCleaner safe. It's a really advanced tool which is more prone to bugs than the much simpler TFC is. By default, it cleans History, Cookies, recent documents, clipboard, memory dumps (not just 3 years old, yesterday's), chkdsk file fragments, Windows log files, Firefox data, various application data, etc. All it takes is for Firefox to unexpectedly change it's file structure or profile binary formats and it could end up corrupting your whole profile.

And it's flagship part, temp file cleaning, is not done as well as TFC. TFC is a highly aggressive temp file cleaner, but only of temp files - safe files to delete otherwise they wouldn't be in those folders - not of all this other stuff CCleaner does.

Digerati said:
"1" case of CCleaner causing problems does not justify condemning it forever. I note millions and millions of users use it every day with no problems.

Registry Cleaner Broke My computer - CCleaner Discussion - Piriform Community Forums
Ccleaner broken my programs? - Yahoo Answers
Registry cleaner broke my computer, how can I fix it? | Clean Up Computer
CCleaner Registry Cleaner Breaks Windows 8 Store

etc. etc.

There *is* a risk. You would be absolutely wrong to deny that is NEVER goes wrong - just occasionally, exceptionally rarely, once in a blue moon, whatever you want to call it, it goes wrong.

And the evidence is that there is no speed improvement to be had. Risk of really bad failure for no speed improvement is not a good tradeoff.

Digerati said:
I would ask, have you ever had a malware scanner remove a critical file? Have you ever had a disk diagnostics make a disk unreadable? Haver you ever had a Windows or driver update break a computer? Did you condemn those products forever?

No, I do not condemn them, and I accept that there is a risk with each of those products. But for a benefit, a large benefit, and it's worth the risk. With registry cleaners, it's not worth the risk.

Also, the article you linked to is invalid. It tested registry cleaners and file system cleaners TOGETHER. You need to separate the registry cleaners for a fair test (only change one variable at a time, all that...). Find me a SINGLE test which does that and finds in registry cleaners favour and I will be extremely impressed.

If you cannot accept the mountain of evidence before you then there must be a parting of the ways. I cannot agree with what you say with the evidence you have provided. Find me more evidence and I will reconsider.

Richard

NoelDP · Dec 31, 2013

Re: Vista Hardware Driver Removal

My major complaint about the Langa article is the choice of test utilities.
CCLeaner I can understand - but Clleanmgr is NOT a registry cleaner, and who apart from us geeks has ever heard of JV16?
He should have tested some of the following as well...
WiseFixer (KNOWN to cause problems with Win 7's SPPSVC and VSS services)
ASC (KNOWN to cause MGA problems)
System Mechanic (KNOWN to cause MGA problems)
etc... etc...

The KNOWN problems arise every time a significant upgrade to the OS is released - When Win7 was released there were a rash of problems, and another when SP1 was released. There are still occasional problems even now (and those are only the ones that I see in my limited forum spread, which really is the tip of the iceberg)

Digerati · Dec 31, 2013

Re: Vista Hardware Driver Removal

Please, I beseech you, do not be blind to the evidence before you.

I have to give you the same advice and say the same thing to you - starting with your own links.

Find me a SINGLE test which does that and finds in registry cleaners favour and I will be extremely impressed.

I did, but you blew it off (this after you linked file cleaning with registry cleaning yourself when you dismissed CCleaner for TFC). You even blew off your own favorable link to DropSend.com. :confused2:

Do any of your links use empirical evidence based on real tests showing Registry cleaners will break our machines? Nope!

And with all due respect to Kat and Chris, their extensive experience is in malware removal and computer security. Contrary to what some believe, being an expert in malware removal or computer security does not make them experts in all areas of computer support, maintenance and repair. I mean "if you “clean” your registry often enough, it will become fragmented"! ??? Come on! Where's the evidence of that? Note an empty space is not a fragment.

Note I respect Ed Bott, but that often referenced article is nearly 9 years old! Hardly current. Fred Langa's uses Windows 7. Your link to Computer Hope actually recommends 3 registry cleaners so it clearly contradicts itself, and you.

Did you read the Top10Reviews link you provided? Hardly an argument for your side. Note they state clearly,

TopTenReviews (from your link) said:
investing in a solid registry cleaner application may be well worth it since you will avoid the hassle of a slow computer or a botched attempt at a manual registry overhaul.

Clearly Mark Russinovich is probably one of the world's most regarded Windows Registry expert. While an old article, I note he states in his TechNet article Registry Junk: A Windows Fact of Life,

So it seems that Registry junk is a Windows fact of life and that Registry cleaners will continue to have a place in the anal-sysadmin’s tool chest, at least until we’re all running .NET applications that store their per-user settings in XML files – and then of course we’ll need XML cleaners.

Curious? Since you are so against Registry cleaners, have you tested them yourself? To see for yourself if they end up making your computers worse? Or if they improve boot and load times? Or cleanup uninstalled driver issues? To see for yourself if you can duplicate all these reported problems? For the record, I have used CCleaner for over 10 years, without exaggeration, on 100s of computers that have direct (personal and/or contractual) responsibility for. So I have years of hands-on personal experience with it. Do you? I have also tested extensively Glary Utilities, and Comodo System Cleaner (now called Comodo PC Tuneup). I have NEVER - not once - had CCleaner break any system. I have had one incident each where the more aggressive Glary and Comodo cleaners resulted in problems - but in both those cases, it was easy to back out of the changes by using each program's restore features. But note I was only testing those two program and don't use them regularly, as I do CCleaner.

To reiterate a key point. You will NOT find a single link on any forum where I have told a poster to use Registry cleaners to fix a problem. In fact, I rarely ever recommend the use of a Registry cleaner at all - but I do challenge those who immediately respond with claims they are so dangerous they should never be used, or to those who lump all cleaners together.

Now I don't want to run this topic any more OT.

Digerati · Dec 31, 2013

Re: Vista Hardware Driver Removal

WiseFixer (KNOWN to cause problems with Win 7's SPPSVC and VSS services)
ASC (KNOWN to cause MGA problems)
System Mechanic (KNOWN to cause MGA problems)

I have never heard of WiseFixer or ASC. But I've been familiar with jv16 for many years.

That said, I note Fred's stated intent was not to review products - he was quite clear from the start (with his bold italics),

First, let me be perfectly clear about this report: my tests were not designed to find the best Registry cleaner — or even a comparative analysis of one cleanup tool versus another.

My sole point was to see whether the general principles of system and Registry cleaning deliver quantifiable, measurable improvements to Windows 7.

NoelDP · Dec 31, 2013

Re: Vista Hardware Driver Removal

All the 'Utilities' I quoted are peddled throughout the internet by various affiliates, and have very efficient marketing and sales departments, and very inefficient support departments - they play the numbers game WRT their registry 'fixes' extremely well, and the consequence is that Joe Public spends money, and people like us have to pick up the pieces.
(ASC is Advanced System Care)

As you say, this really is well OT now - let's wait for the OP to return, if we haven't frightened him off.

Digerati · Dec 31, 2013

Re: Vista Hardware Driver Removal

First, after re-reading what I said earlier, I want to emphasis I was not (or certainly did not intend to be) discrediting anyone's expertise. My apologies, especially to Kat and Chris, if it came out that way. I have just seen it too often whether malware removal or hardware, or security or Windows expert, the messes we see in the trenches is not necessarily what is happening in the real world. Like the Honda mechanic thinking Hondas are junk because that's what he sees all day long.

All the 'Utilities' I quoted are peddled throughout the internet by various affiliates

I am sure there are dozens - which is part of the problem. We all know about so-called spyware scanners that bilk you into paying them to remove spyware they put on your machines! Just like anti-malware scanners, insurance companies, and power supplies, not all Registry scanners are the same! And not all are marketed as cure-all snake oils either.

I am not denying there are downsides to Registry cleaners - that's why all the proponents harp about backing up the registry first so you can recover in the rare event you do have a problem.

I think there needs to be separation of the two questions involved. (1) Do Registry cleaners do harm? (2) Do Registry cleaners improve performance?

(1) "Do" they cause harm? One in millions of uses, yes.

(2) Do they improve (or "optimize") performance? Depends. Yes, they can improve boot times and application load times. No, if you want to argue that boot and load times are NOT an indication of performance.

I also feel CCleaner should be singled out for it does not promise to do wondrous things to make your computers run better than new (for a price, of course!). Nor does CCleaner claim to be a Registry "fixer". It clearly states it just removes unused and old entries...[/QUOTE]

Most of the published opposition just reprints and retells of the same stories. That's why I feel regarded experts like Russinovich (PhD in this stuff) and Langa saying 'a good cleaner has its place in our tool boxes' should be taken into consideration as to there might be something to it. I don't have advanced degrees in software development, they do. I am not a Windows expert and I too cringe when a poster or customer says they tried to fix it with this, that, and the other thing, or things, too.

Again, I don't promote CCleaner's Registry cleaner to "fix" Windows, neither does Piriform.

Are the advantages over-hyped? Of course! That's what marketing fluff is all about. I am just saying the disadvantages are over-hyped too.

I use CCleaner's Registry cleaner to "keep" my systems running at top performance, not to make them run better than they ever have. If load and unload programs for testing, swap out hardware, swap out security programs, or other wise make frequent changes to your system other than simple updates, I contend you will benefit with regular use of good cleaner like CCleaners.

For beginners, I would MUCH rather they use CCleaner then manually dig around with regedit - where changes are immediate, with no backing up or "esc". And since I feel CCleaner is safer than regedit, I feel we should saying how it should be used properly instead is automatically dissuading their use.

NoelDP · Jan 1, 2014

Re: Vista Hardware Driver Removal

My standard advice about the use of registry cleaners is that they should never be used unless you already know enough about the registry not to need to use them.

Digerati · Jan 1, 2014

Re: Vista Hardware Driver Removal

My standard advice...

I guess that is where we differ. I don't believe a "standard advice" applies here (other than to backup the registry before dinking with it).

If Registry cleaners broke computers, you should be able to set up a scenario to demonstrate that. And then you should be able to replicate that action to show it was not a quirk - just as Fred Langa did to show the benefits. But sadly, after 10 years, I have never seen a real study showing they are dangerous. There have been a few showing no significant performance gains. And a couple showing some benefits, but I have never seen one showing they, or in particular, CCleaner's damages Windows. Why?

Sure, there are examples of posters saying they ran this cleaner or that "optimizer" and now the system does not work. But unless you can duplicate the problem, nothing is conclusive. And without knowing the status of the system before running the cleaner, and without knowing what else the user did before running the cleaner (and they typically try many things before reaching out for help), blaming the cleaner alone is not a fair conclusion.

What is often very surprising is to pull your fellow experienced computer users to the side and go off-record. It may surprise you to learn how many experienced users use tools they would NEVER recommend in public for others to use.

There is a lot of "do as I say, not as I do" in this business!

Anyway, sorry again for straying (dragging) your thread so far OT, VistaDJ - I now return you to our regularly scheduled programming.

NoelDP · Jan 1, 2014

Re: Vista Hardware Driver Removal

If Registry cleaners broke computers, you should be able to set up a scenario to demonstrate that.

Very simple.
Install Win 7 Home Premium
Install WiseFixer
Run WiseFixer

et voila!

Digerati · Jan 1, 2014

Re: Vista Hardware Driver Removal

Sorry you don't take this seriously.

For one, that is not CCleaner. Second, it is pretty much an unknown product, not even making TopTenReviews list. Third, it is not free - but nearly $40, for just one year! In my book, that makes it a rip-off and not a legitimate product.

That said, if your scenario were even remotely true, Bing and Google searches for Wisefixer would be full of hits about it. But they aren't. And C|Net Downloads would be full of user comments reporting it broke their systems too. But again, not so.

Sorry once and for all, VistaDJ. No more OT comments.

NoelDP · Jan 1, 2014

Re: Vista Hardware Driver Removal

Digerati said:
Sorry you don't take this seriously.

There's 'Top Ten' - and then there's the 'ten most likely to be seen by Joe Public'.
I was perfectly serious.

NoelDP · Jan 1, 2014

Re: Vista Hardware Driver Removal

...and there is a free version of the registry cleaner ... Wise Registry Cleaner - Free download and software reviews - CNET Download.com

Digerati · Jan 1, 2014

Re: Vista Hardware Driver Removal

I was perfectly serious.

Yeah, right! Then please! Put your money where your mouth is and show us legitimate (or even any) reports where simply installing Wisefixer will break our computers.

There's 'Top Ten' - and then there's the 'ten most likely to be seen by Joe Public'.

And Wisefixer is on neither list. In fact, using Bing to search for best registry cleaners and you have to hunt down the list to find it anywhere.

Best Registry Cleaners For 2014 | Editor's Choice
Best Registry Cleaner Reviews of 2013
Which is the Best Registry Cleaner for 2013?
Best Registry Cleaner 2013 | Top 10 Registry Cleaners
Registry Cleaners Software Review 2014 | Best Registry Cleaners | PC Cleaner Software - TopTenREVIEWS
Top Registry Cleaner Revealed for 2014 | Read Our In Depth Review
BEST REGISTRY CLEANER? - Pro Mark Anderson Examines the TEN best.

And sorry, but Wise Registry Cleaner is not from the same people as WiseFixer as a quick look would have easily shown. A quick look at your link would have also easily shown the vast majority of users were happy. So again, sorry, but you are not being serious. I am done wasting the OP's time.

Tekno Venus · Jan 1, 2014

These posts have been taken from this thread - https://www.sysnative.com/forums/wi...41-windows-vista-hardware-driver-removal.html

All further discussion will take place in this thread.

Tekno Venus · Jan 1, 2014

My humble opinion on this topic - and why I don't use registry cleaners.

Ran many registry cleaners on a Windows XP laptop ~2007/8 time. Machine became unusably slow. Never got around to reinstalling.
Ran System Mechanic over the course of a year on my old Vista laptop ~2010. Again, became unusable - taking >>15 minutes to boot. Reinstall solved all issues and laptop has since been sold and works perfectly still (I provide IT support to the person I sold it to)
Ran System Mechanic on the same year on a second laptop. Only booted 1/2 of the time, very slow, application errors etc. Since a reinstall of Vista it works fine and is now our family laptop.

I know, and fully understand this is a very small test sample, but I don't want to take the risk on any of my systems again. I do not use, and never recommend the use of registry cleaners.

Stephen

NoelDP · Jan 1, 2014

***** <GRRR> - I just spent 30 minutes building a response only to lose it thanks to a browser crash...

Suffice it to say that searching CNET for 'System Utilities' or 'Registry Cleaner' with the Windows Option brings up ASC, and Registry Mechanic (may I misremembered that?) and Wise Registry Cleaner.

I don't know where people get/got WiseFixer from - but the file (got through CNet's listing) isn't signed by the 'advertised' company, but by a Chinese one with an unpronounceable name (LongzeXiangsu New Technology Development Co., Ltd.).

Wise Registry Cleaner is at least signed by the company that distributes it.

I just installed and ran WRC (default mode) in my standard Win7 x64 VM and it claimed 59 registry errors (1 unsafe - whatever that means!) of which it corrected 58. The remaining one was HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\MIME\Database\Content Type\image/vnd.ms-dds (Extension .dds)
It did NOT back up the deletions although there is a not-obvious option to either back up the registry beforehand, or create a System Restore Point. It also claims to 'autobackup registry before cleanup'
Using the restore option only restored 52 of the 'errors'?

Running the 'DeepScan' mode afterwards found 1 more error - a MUI Cache entry in a removable drive.

At no point is it possible to export a list of the found errors - but 24 of the found errors were place-holders for .NET 1.0, and 18 were
"uninstallers with invalid uninstall information', 2 'Empty' Application paths and 5 'File Types' errors

Not as bad as expected, I have to admit - maybe I should load the system a bit.

I'll try WiseFixer a little later...

Tekno Venus · Jan 1, 2014

NoelDP said:
***** <GRRR> - I just spent 30 minutes building a response only to lose it thanks to a browser crash.....

Do you use Firefox or Chrome? download - Lazarus Form Recovery I use it myself - it's saved me many, many times!

Should you use a registry cleaner?

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