Building opinions

[Go The Power]

I have decided that it's time for a new PC. My current one is too slow to do anything. I don't play many games (I have an Xbox for that), I mainly just need one that is very fast at processing and very good at multi tasking. I don't do much graphics, I want to be able to use VM with no issues. When it comes to hardware I don't know much about it. This is what I have come up with so far any recommendations? Am I spending to much on something? Or not enough on something else (only reason for shopping at MSY is the confidence of a local store)

Motherboard
-$115
Gigabyte Z87M-D3H Intel Z87 S1150/4xDDR3/2xPCI-E/SATA3/USB3.0/HDMI/GBLAN/RAID/Miicro ATX MB - MSY SA Online


CPU
-$269
Intel Core i5 4670K 3.4GHz 6MB - MSY SA Online


Video card
-165
Asus GTX650-E-2GD5 2GB GTX650 PCI-E VGA Card - MSY SA Online


RAM
-170
G.Skill Aegis F3-1600C11D-16GISL 1.35V (Low Voltage) 16GB Kit (8Gx2) DDR3 1600 - MSY SA Online


SSD
-79
Kingston KINSV300S37A/120G 120GB SSDNOW V300 SATA3 2.5" SSD HDD - MSY SA Online


PSU
-82
Thermaltake LitePower W0356R 700Watt PSU - MSY SA Online


Case
-99
Thermaltake VP300A6W2N A31 Snow White USB3.0 Mid Tower Case without PSU - MSY SA Online

i have a 2TB HDD and DVD burner that I will be using

thanks guys

 

[bassfisher6522]

Everything looks pretty darn good to me....it should be a very good PC for you. The only suggestion I can advise is the SSD...I would up that to a 240/250GB...other wise you only have enough room for your OS and a Office with very little room for anything else.

 

[niemiro]

Whilst larger SSDs are always nice, I guess it partially depends on price too, and whether that means that you have to cut back on other components as a result. I have a system from a couple of years back when all SSDs were much smaller, which I use as my main system, with an SSD only 64GB in size. Windows & Office combined will come in about 30-35GB tops (often much lower, but it does vary, and that size also allows for some temp files, prefetch, a portion of the pagefile, etc.).

I don't put most of my programs on the SSD, but I've still got Windows, Office, Visual Studio, and a bunch of other very large development tools & SDKs on there for fast compile times. It sometimes feels a little squashed at times, in which case I delete any accumulation of temp & other junk files, and a 128GB would perhaps sometimes be nice, but 64GB does the job so I assume a 128GB would be ample.

BTW, what sort of HDD is it? Is it something fast enough to use for programs (like a Caviar Blue/Black), or is it a very slow data/"eco" drive? If it's a slow drive, then perhaps investment in an SSD would be a good idea.

Also, you got the cost of Windows and/or Office/others factored into the cost if you don't already have spares lying around?

As for the rest, I don't really wish to comment. I have no real idea about hardware, but it looks good from a cursory glance.

Richard

 

[Wrench97]

Are you planing to overclock or run more then 1 video card?

I would opt for 1.5v sticks over the low voltage 1.35v(they are a fairly new arrival and the 9x series motherboards are more suited to run them then current boards IMHO.

The Thermaltake lite power W0356R is a fairly recent unit also replacing the W0356 that was built by HEC, the R is probably built by Solytech or HEC.
The Lite power 350w and 450w built by CWT got decent reviews but the larger units reviews have not been particularly flattering.
The Antec Neo ECO 620w is a good unit for a couple bucks more> Antec Neo Eco 620C-BR 80Plus Bronze 620W PSU - MSY SA Online

 

[Go The Power]

Everything looks pretty darn good to me....it should be a very good PC for you. The only suggestion I can advise is the SSD...I would up that to a 240/250GB...other wise you only have enough room for your OS and a Office with very little room for anything else.

Thank you I will consider this. when it comes to SSDs is there brands I should stay away from? or brands I should go with?

Whilst larger SSDs are always nice, I guess it partially depends on price too, and whether that means that you have to cut back on other components as a result. I have a system from a couple of years back when all SSDs were much smaller, which I use as my main system, with an SSD only 64GB in size. Windows & Office combined will come in about 30-35GB tops (often much lower, but it does vary, and that size also allows for some temp files, prefetch, a portion of the pagefile, etc.).

I don't put most of my programs on the SSD, but I've still got Windows, Office, Visual Studio, and a bunch of other very large development tools & SDKs on there for fast compile times. It sometimes feels a little squashed at times, in which case I delete any accumulation of temp & other junk files, and a 128GB would perhaps sometimes be nice, but 64GB does the job so I assume a 128GB would be ample.

BTW, what sort of HDD is it? Is it something fast enough to use for programs (like a Caviar Blue/Black), or is it a very slow data/"eco" drive? If it's a slow drive, then perhaps investment in an SSD would be a good idea.

Also, you got the cost of Windows and/or Office/others factored into the cost if you don't already have spares lying around?

I was planning on only using the SSD for the main big programs, if I do buy a larger one I would most likely use it for more programs.

At the moment there are three HDD I could choose from. Two are 2TB external HDD and one is a 1TB HDD that is in my current computer. All 3 are Seagate SATA III 6.0GB/s 7200 RPM.

As for MS Office, I currenlty have 2013 which I picked up from work for a very cheap price. MS Office is currently installed on my PC now, I just need to transfer it over to my new computer.

The price for the OS I have added into the cost. But I can't decide if I want to stick with 8 or go back to 7..

Are you planing to overclock or run more then 1 video card?

I would opt for 1.5v sticks over the low voltage 1.35v(they are a fairly new arrival and the 9x series motherboards are more suited to run them then current boards IMHO.

The Thermaltake lite power W0356R is a fairly recent unit also replacing the W0356 that was built by HEC, the R is probably built by Solytech or HEC.
The Lite power 350w and 450w built by CWT got decent reviews but the larger units reviews have not been particularly flattering.
The Antec Neo ECO 620w is a good unit for a couple bucks more> Antec Neo Eco 620C-BR 80Plus Bronze 620W PSU - MSY SA Online

No I wasnt planning on overclocking or running more than one Video card. With the Video card I have chosen I assume that I can run three monitors (if I wish) as there is two DVI and one HDMI port?

I will get the PSU that you have recommended as well. As for the the RAM would this be a better option?
G.Skill Ripjaws-X 16G Kit(8Gx2) DDR3 1600 F3-12800CL10D-16GBXL - MSY SA Online

Thanks for all the advice guys :)

 

[Wrench97]

Yes they are sticks I have used several times and they are listed as compatible > RipjawsX - F3-12800CL10D-16GBXL - G.SKILL DDR3 Memory

Samsung 840 EVO series are currently my favorite SSD drive.

GTX650's support 4 monitors, that particular card says it has no aux Power connector I'm assuming it will still support 4 monitors but without a display port on the card I'm not sure how you would hook them up.

 

[Go The Power]

Thanks I will look into the Samsung 840 series.

i will be building this machine over the next month or so, have to buy the parts over a couple of weeks.

 

[Laxer]

I agree with everything stated above.

If you don't really care about being current gen you may see a performance increase dropping down to a 3770 versus the 4670k...

The extra threads really help out VMs, of course if you did this you would have to scratch your mobo and select another.

 

[Go The Power]

Sorry I am not sure what you are referring too? Do you mean the CPU? The CPU is currently 4670.

When it comes to hardware I am clueless :grin1:

 

[Digerati]

Gigabyte is my preferred motherboard maker so already I like this system. :)

The price for the OS I have added into the cost. But I can't decide if I want to stick with 8 or go back to 7..

This is a no brainer to me. You should get W8. W7 was and still is an excellent OS, but it is already pushing 5 years old!!!! Installing W7 on new hardware today is fast forwarding your system into retirement, and into the same situation XP is in today.

It is easy to make W8 look, feel and behave like W7 with Start8.

Bottom line: W8 is more secure! And faster. 'Nuff said on that.

Just be sure to get 64-bit Windows 8, since you have more than 4Gb of RAM. Note if you get the OEM/System Builders license, you have to specify 64-bit at the time of purchase (only the much more expensive, full retail license includes both 32-bit and 64-bit in the box). The downside to OEM is (1) the System Builder (you, in this case) assume warranty support responsibility for Windows for 1 year, and (2) the license is inextricably tied to the original motherboard it was used with - that is, it is NOT transferable to another computer or upgraded motherboard, under ANY circumstances. Period.

While your graphics card is a nice card, and when it comes to budgets, I am one to normally push increasing graphics horsepower before CPU horsepower, for a non-gaming rig, that ASUS 650 GTX will never be taxed. You could cut back here to increase your SSD.

BTW - I built this system with the Samsung 840 "Pro" Series 256Gb SSD as my boot drive. I have Windows and all my apps installed on the SSD, including Office Pro and still over 150Gb free. I use my big HD as a secondary drive to store backups of c, photos, tunes, etc.

Back to graphics and if you still want that card, IF ME, I would go with Gigabyte's version of the GTX 650 for several reasons.

1. They are double wide. This is significant for a couple reasons, but the most important is heat removal. The last line in my sig says it all. A double wide card exhausts the heat from the GPU and graphics RAM directly out the back of the case - a very good thing. The single wide Asus card dumps that heat right back into the case - not a very good thing.

2. The Gigabyte card supports more video output options.

3. The card from the same maker as the motherboard instills greater confidence (in me anyway) they will work great together without problems (probably not a problem with ASUS and Gigabyte, but the pessimist in me wins this time).

4. Double wide cards are secured at 3 points (2 screws and 1 slot) for total "perpendicular" stability and support. A single slot card is supported by the slot and a single screw on the same "plane" as the slot. A big heavy card like a these can put strain on the slot - especially with tower (upright oriented) cases.​

i will be building this machine over the next month or so, have to buy the parts over a couple of weeks.

I would discourage that strategy and instead, recommend you save your money until you can purchase everything at once. This is because,

1. The warranty period begins on the date of purchase - not the date you install the product. Plus "life" tends to get in the way of the best plans, and unexpected delays and expenditures between purchases could further affect warranties.

2. Waiting ensures you have the latest versions (important when it comes to drivers, and especially BIOS versions).

3. Something better, cheaper, faster, more powerful always comes along the day after you make your purchase. Okay - this last is not necessarily true, but sometimes it sure seems that way.​

 

[Digerati]

Oh, forgot something. Whenever buying ANY motherboard, be sure to check the QVLs (qualified vendor lists) on the board's website for CPUs and RAM for that specific board to ensure compatibility.

You MUST buy a listed CPU to ensure that. But there are just too many RAM makers and RAM models for motherboard makers to test them all. So you don't have to buy listed RAM, but MUST buy RAM with the same specs as listed RAM.

Your QVLs are listed here. Your CPU is listed but your RAM is not listed. Wrench's suggested RAM is.

 

[Go The Power]

Thank you very much Bill for that information.

This is a no brainer to me. You should get W8. W7 was and still is an excellent OS, but it is already pushing 5 years old!!!! Installing W7 on new hardware today is fast forwarding your system into retirement, and into the same situation XP is in today.

I currently have 8.1 on my current PC, the start button toke a few weeks to get used to, but I got used to it by Pinning all my programs to my task bar. I have had any real issues with 8.1 as of yet. Time flies I wouldn't of thought Win7 was already 5 years old.

Just be sure to get 64-bit Windows 8, since you have more than 4Gb of RAM. Note if you get the OEM/System Builders license, you have to specify 64-bit at the time of purchase (only the much more expensive, full retail license includes both 32-bit and 64-bit in the box). The downside to OEM is (1) the System Builder (you, in this case) assume warranty support responsibility for Windows for 1 year, and (2) the license is inextricably tied to the original motherboard it was used with - that is, it is NOT transferable to another computer or upgraded motherboard, under ANY circumstances. Period.

I was planning on going with a 64 system. When trying to decide between OEM and Retail I was looking at the price mainly, but I decided to go with Retail as it will be easier to transfer in case of a hardware failure.

Back to graphics and if you still want that card, IF ME, I would go with Gigabyte's version of the GTX 650 for several reasons.

One like this ?
Gigabyte GV-N650OC-2GI 2GB GTX650 PCI-E VGA Card - MSY SA Online

I would discourage that strategy and instead, recommend you save your money until you can purchase everything at once.

After getting the list of all the parts I have been getting quite keen to build it ASAP, I hoping to have it built by the end of next week.

Oh, forgot something. Whenever buying ANY motherboard, be sure to check the QVLs (qualified vendor lists) on the board's website for CPUs and RAM for that specific board to ensure compatibility.

You MUST buy a listed CPU to ensure that. But there are just too many RAM makers and RAM models for motherboard makers to test them all. So you don't have to buy listed RAM, but MUST buy RAM with the same specs as listed RAM.

Your QVLs are listed here. Your CPU is listed but your RAM is not listed. Wrench's suggested RAM is.

Thank you that is very helpful, I decided to go with the RAM that Wrench suggested.

 

[Digerati]

It looks like the fan housing on that card is not totally enclosed, so only some of the air blasted onto the GPU heatsink will be channeled out the back. Better than nothing. And for sure, if you will be using more than one monitor (and who can live with just one???) two DVI ports makes it easy - much easier than dealing with HDMI which sadly, has not been ported to the computer world from the home theater world as trouble-free as HDMI supporters would have liked, and as the hype over HDMI suggests.

I only recommend HDMI on computers if you will be using a monitor with integrated speakers (or connecting to a TV).

I hoping to have it built by the end of next week.

Great! One last suggestion. Once you have selected, in particular, your motherboard and case, I recommend you download their respective manuals to become familiar with that motherboard, and the case connections to it BEFORE they actually arrive and patience falls to the wayside. Sadly, there is no industry standard for labels, so for example, the motherboard may say FP PWR (front panel power switch) while the case's wires may be labeled P. SW. The motherboard may say HD LED while the case may say HD Act (for activity).

Also, remember that cases are designed to support 1000s of different motherboards, of various sizes. So there is almost always more motherboard mounting points in the case, than mounting holes in the motherboard. This WILL be especially true installing a µATX board in a mid tower ATX case. So you want to be 200% sure you ONLY insert a case stand-off where there is a corresponding motherboard mounting hole. Otherwise, you risk shorting out the motherboard (and potential permanent damage) if you power up with an extra standoff (or other foreign object - like a loose screw) under the board.

Finally - brush up on your your ESD control discipline.

And yes, the full retail version does make it easy (and cost free) to install Windows on a different PC (or the same PC with an upgraded motherboard - considered for licensing purposes, a "new" PC). As long as Windows using that license is ONLY installed on one computer at a time.

 

[Wrench97]

Sorry I am not sure what you are referring too? Do you mean the CPU? The CPU is currently 4670.

When it comes to hardware I am clueless :grin1:

Yes he's referring to the CPU the 3770 is a i7 1 generation old, the difference is that i7's have hyper-threading hyper-threaded cores can run 2 threads each as opposed to a single thread per core on the i3/i5. To Windows these appear as 2 cores so the i7 CPU's will be seen a 8 cores by Windows instead of 4 cores.
Not as rosy as it sounds because if the cpu is heavily loaded it will drop the hyper-threading and run as a quad core.

The last update to from the 3xxx CPU's to the 4xxx series dealt mainly with video side(the CPU also contains a GPU that runs the integrated video) not the data side of the processor so if the i7 3770 is on sale down there it may be the same price as the i5 4670K.

 

[Laxer]

The last update to from the 3xxx CPU's to the 4xxx series dealt mainly with video side(the CPU also contains a GPU that runs the integrated video) not the data side of the processor so if the i7 3770 is on sale down there it may be the same price as the i5 4670K.

My thoughts exactly Bruce.

It was on the MSY site the other day when I looked for $259 but seems it is gone now


Sorry for not being more clear Alex, thought you knew more about hardware :smile9:

 

[Go The Power]

It looks like the fan housing on that card is not totally enclosed, so only some of the air blasted onto the GPU heatsink will be channeled out the back. Better than nothing. And for sure, if you will be using more than one monitor (and who can live with just one???) two DVI ports makes it easy - much easier than dealing with HDMI which sadly, has not been ported to the computer world from the home theater world as trouble-free as HDMI supporters would have liked, and as the hype over HDMI suggests.

I only recommend HDMI on computers if you will be using a monitor with integrated speakers (or connecting to a TV).

I hoping to have it built by the end of next week.

Great! One last suggestion. Once you have selected, in particular, your motherboard and case, I recommend you download their respective manuals to become familiar with that motherboard, and the case connections to it BEFORE they actually arrive and patience falls to the wayside. Sadly, there is no industry standard for labels, so for example, the motherboard may say FP PWR (front panel power switch) while the case's wires may be labeled P. SW. The motherboard may say HD LED while the case may say HD Act (for activity).

Also, remember that cases are designed to support 1000s of different motherboards, of various sizes. So there is almost always more motherboard mounting points in the case, than mounting holes in the motherboard. This WILL be especially true installing a µATX board in a mid tower ATX case. So you want to be 200% sure you ONLY insert a case stand-off where there is a corresponding motherboard mounting hole. Otherwise, you risk shorting out the motherboard (and potential permanent damage) if you power up with an extra standoff (or other foreign object - like a loose screw) under the board.

Finally - brush up on your your ESD control discipline.

And yes, the full retail version does make it easy (and cost free) to install Windows on a different PC (or the same PC with an upgraded motherboard - considered for licensing purposes, a "new" PC). As long as Windows using that license is ONLY installed on one computer at a time.

Does having a the fan not enclosed make much difference? Would I be better of getting on that is enclosed? I couldn't live with only one monitor I have been spoilt with the luxury of two for years.

I will be very carefully with installing the motherboard to make sure it is in the right place, last thing I did is to short out the mother board. I will definitely download the manuals for both the case and motherboard and have a good read of them before starting the build.

Sorry I am not sure what you are referring too? Do you mean the CPU? The CPU is currently 4670.

When it comes to hardware I am clueless :grin1:

Yes he's referring to the CPU the 3770 is a i7 1 generation old, the difference is that i7's have hyper-threading hyper-threaded cores can run 2 threads each as opposed to a single thread per core on the i3/i5. To Windows these appear as 2 cores so the i7 CPU's will be seen a 8 cores by Windows instead of 4 cores.
Not as rosy as it sounds because if the cpu is heavily loaded it will drop the hyper-threading and run as a quad core.

The last update to from the 3xxx CPU's to the 4xxx series dealt mainly with video side(the CPU also contains a GPU that runs the integrated video) not the data side of the processor so if the i7 3770 is on sale down there it may be the same price as the i5 4670K.

Ah that makes sense now. When I was first looking at choosing a CPU I was trying to choose if i should go with an i7 or i5. The two threads would be good for speed, but you say if the CPU is heavily loaded it drops down, what classifies as heavily loaded?

The last update to from the 3xxx CPU's to the 4xxx series dealt mainly with video side(the CPU also contains a GPU that runs the integrated video) not the data side of the processor so if the i7 3770 is on sale down there it may be the same price as the i5 4670K.

My thoughts exactly Bruce.

It was on the MSY site the other day when I looked for $259 but seems it is gone now


Sorry for not being more clear Alex, thought you knew more about hardware :smile9:

Its okay :) Hardware has never been an area I have taken much interest in until now. I have replaced basic parts inside a computer but never build one from scratch. I normally just buy on of the shelf.

 

[Digerati]

Does having a the fan not enclosed make much difference? Would I be better of getting on that is enclosed? I couldn't live with only one monitor I have been spoilt with the luxury of two for years.

It is important to remember that it is the case's responsibility to ensure an adequate supply of cool air "flows" through the case. All the CPU and GPU (and chipset, if not passive) fans need to do is "toss" the heat from the devices they cool into that flow. So even if the graphics card fan exhausts no heat out the back, your case cooling should expel the heat with no problem (assuming your case cooling is properly set up for good "front to back" flow). Since it appears that card's fan will expel at least some of the heat, then I don't see a problem.

And I agree about multiple monitors - they (along with a full sized keyboard and mouse) are why I will never migrate to a tiny smart phone for my primary computer.

 

[Go The Power]

Thanks I will be getting the extra fans for the case to ensure good flow.

As for a smart device I have an iPad mini which is great for taking with me but I would not be able to use it as my primary system.

 

[bassfisher6522]

GTP....when you get all your components in and have assembled it....lets see some pictures of how the build went from start to finish.

 

[Go The Power]

I will keep you guys posted on the progress :)