Intermittent 4K@30Hz (DP on GTX 660)

S

shura

Well-known member
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Feb 2, 2014
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Ahoy all,

I've treated myself to an LG 27UD68P-B monitor and it's connected to my GTX 660 via DisplayPort (Win7, Core i5 3450, 16Gb RAM). Aside from a few idiotic things (at least to someone who always used Dell monitors), it's an excellent monitor and 4K at 60Hz works. However, sometimes, after waking up from sleep, there is the "boink" sound of something getting disconnected and the frequency drops to 30Hz with no option of 60Hz in the frequency menu (windows or through Nvidia's control panel). Restarting the computer fixes this. I am using the DP cable that came with the monitor and the monitor's picture ratio is set to "wide" ("1:1" produces a black frame when I run games at lower resolution).

After the last time it happened, I've reinstalled the nvidia driver and installed the monitor driver that came with it (assuming the latter is of any use at all). Any suggestions beyond that? The monitor is returnable for another few weeks, so I'm just trying to figure this, hopefully before the time runs out.

Thanks!
 
Did you update your graphics card driver? I might be tempted to try HDMI and see if you get the same symptoms.
 
Digerati said:
Did you update your graphics card driver? I might be tempted to try HDMI and see if you get the same symptoms.
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Yes, a clean reinstall of the gpu driver (please see initial post).
Hooking it up to the hdmi port might be tempting, but this is an old card and it only does 4K@30Hz over hdmi, so there won't be much to see in terms of this particular issue.
This card always had minor issues waking up with some driver versions (lone pointer on completely black screen, taking a while to output anything, etc), but never required a restart to eventually work properly. That was with a FHD Dell monitor, which is now gone on craigslist.

Is a new PC in order? :)
 
Yes, a clean reinstall of the gpu driver (please see initial post).
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I did but noted you said you reinstalled the nvidia driver. And you just said "reinstall" again. "Re"install does not imply you downloaded and installed the latest update.

Is a new PC in order? :)
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No but the fact you put a :) (smile) after asking implies you might be looking for an excuse to buy a new computer to go with that new monitor! ;) You said this card has always been troublesome, it sure might be time to look at upgrading the card.

Also, I note that not all cables are created equally. And sadly, monitor makers don't always include quality cables with their monitors. It might be worth replacing the cable to see what happens.

The problem with troubleshooting this is you said it sometimes gives problems. Intermittent problems are always the most difficult, especially if you cannot duplicate the problem at will. The boink sound typically means a lost connection through some interface - like with a USB device. But the connection can be lost anywhere along the line.

Oddly, I am showing where that monitor has a headphone jack, but don't see that it has speakers. :huh: Are you running audio through your graphics card or through a separate sound device (card or integrated with motherboard)? If separate, you might check about disabling audio in card in case that is the cause of the boink.
 
I did but noted you said you reinstalled the nvidia driver. And you just said "reinstall" again. "Re"install does not imply you downloaded and installed the latest update.
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I see. I don't use the Nvidia Experience or whatever it's called. I periodically download the stand-alone package and just do a clean install -- in my book that's called "reinstall." Is choosing "clean installation" not equivalent to uninstalling the driver and installing the new one?
No but the fact you put a :) (smile) after asking implies you might be looking for an excuse to buy a new computer to go with that new monitor! ;) You said this card has always been troublesome, it sure might be time to look at upgrading the card.
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Well, upgrading the gpu in a 5-yr old computer... Might as well just get a new PC. Okay, yes, I am looking for an excuse! :)

Also, I note that not all cables are created equally. And sadly, monitor makers don't always include quality cables with their monitors. It might be worth replacing the cable to see what happens.

The problem with troubleshooting this is you said it sometimes gives problems. Intermittent problems are always the most difficult, especially if you cannot duplicate the problem at will. The boink sound typically means a lost connection through some interface - like with a USB device. But the connection can be lost anywhere along the line.

Oddly, I am showing where that monitor has a headphone jack, but don't see that it has speakers. :huh: Are you running audio through your graphics card or through a separate sound device (card or integrated with motherboard)? If separate, you might check about disabling audio in card in case that is the cause of the boink.
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Solid point on the cable. If this happens again, I will try a new DP cable (have a bunch at work).
I am running audio through the onboard realtek adapter to a pair of supernice Edifier speakers. The monitor has crappy downward-firing speakers right behind the screen, so you don't really see them. Those have been muted for good measure. :)
Let me look into actually disabling audio through dp/hdmi, as opposed to not using it for output.

Thanks!
 
softwaremaniac said:
Yes, I had the exact same issue. Get a proper DP cable! (for your new PC :grin1:)
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Okay, my imaginary new PC aside, what's a proper DP cable? Is there a resistance rating of some sort? I have a fancy looking DP cable that came with my work Dell U2715H (incredible monitor, btw), or there's the Amazon Basics cable for like $10... Do we need a gold-plated warm-vinyl-sound type of cable? :)
 
Well, I can't tell you much more than to get a certified DP 1.2 or greater at least 4K@60Hz compatible one. I had the same issue with my original cable on my current monitor, and had to change the cable twice until I found the one that worked. Try to get as short a cable as you can because there's less chance of problems, and yes, I am now using the gold-plated one.
 
Here's an interesting update. With the old DP cable, the PC woke up and the rate was clearly 30Hz (you can immediately tell by the extremely choppy motion of the mouse pointer), but the output rate is stated as 60 Hz. Changed the cable, restarted the machine, all okay, will observe and report.
 
I see. I don't use the Nvidia Experience or whatever it's called. I periodically download the stand-alone package and just do a clean install -- in my book that's called "reinstall." Is choosing "clean installation" not equivalent to uninstalling the driver and installing the new one?
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The key difference between what you said here and what you said previously in your opening post is here you said, "download the stand-alone package". "Downloading" the driver package from the product's website implies the driver is the latest version.

In your opening post, you didn't mention anything about "downloading". You just said you reinstalled. That does not imply you first downloaded the latest version. You could have (as many users do) reinstalled from a previously downloaded (and perhaps outdated) driver - maybe even a very old driver from the installation disk that came with the product years ago.

So it is not a matter of semantics. "Reinstall", taken literally means to install something again that previously installed. "Install updated" implies installing the most recent. I am not being nitpicky. When giving technical advice (and as an adviser, when trying to understand the problem), it is important everyone is on the same page. That's all.

I don't use the Nvidia Experience or whatever it's called.
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I don't either. These programs (including AMD's equivalent) typically try to install other programs and features I don't want "foisted" :censored2: on my system.

Do we need a gold-plated warm-vinyl-sound type of cable? :)
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No. Gold cables (if really gold and not fake - as many are :() are nice because gold does not corrode. What really matters is quality cable connectors solidly inserted in quality sockets, as they will not corrode either (at least not in typical home, climate controlled environments). Good mechanical connections (essential for good electrical connections) by design, keep moisture, dust and other contaminants out of the connector.

You certainly don't have to buy the most expensive cables. In fact, in many cases, they are lousy (don't get me started on Monster brand cables! :(). But I would avoid the cheapest.

That said, even the best sockets (and cable connectors) are subject to wear over time if frequently inserted and removed. This is especially true of the socket which typically uses spring loaded contacts. That spring tension can become weak affecting the effectiveness and strength of that desired and essential "mechanical" connection.

Changed the cable, restarted the machine, all okay, will observe and report.
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Great! Let's hope it sticks. I recommend you label that old cable so 3 or 4 years from now, you know its story. Or just toss it now.
 
That said, even the best sockets (and cable connectors) are subject to wear over time if frequently inserted and removed. This is especially true of the socket which typically uses spring loaded contacts. That spring tension can become weak affecting the effectiveness and strength of that desired and essential "mechanical" connection.
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I'm familiar with the importance of good electrical connection (there's my PhD in EE diploma in here somewhere), just wanted to know what constitutes DP certification, but once again didn't make it very clear. Incidentally, this is the first time in years I used this DP port, it was HDMI the entire time.
In any case, thanks. Not terribly convinced it was the cable, but cautiously optimistic.
 
(there's my PhD in EE diploma in here somewhere)
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That's great and I certainly would not attempt to take anything away from all the hard work and years of dedication it takes to earn a doctorate degree - especially in ever-advancing, high-tech fields like electronics. But as a long time certified electronics technician with a couple of degrees myself, there's a big difference and often bigger disconnect between design/theory and practical application of that theory. What looks great and works perfectly on paper often does not work out in the field - and that's before any potential limitations from impurities in raw materials and imperfections introduced during the manufacturing processes come into play.
Incidentally, this is the first time in years I used this DP port, it was HDMI the entire time.
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That could be significant. Unused cable connectors, if not covered with protective caps, tend to collect dust and grime just sitting on the shelf. Unused connectors in our computers that have "active" cooling (fans) pulling air through the cases also pull in and often pack dust and debris into those connectors.

Besides plain old dust from the outdoors, home environments are full of greasy, grimy contaminants from human and pet dander (cats are the worst), kitchen grease, and in many cases, tobacco smoke residues. Case fans pull air, dust and these greasy contaminants into every crack, crevice and opening in the case (not just the vents) and into the unused, uncovered connectors too. You can blow out the dust but a greasy residue remains unless properly cleaned.

In extreme cases, electrical contact cleaner may be required. But often, simply inserting and removing the connector plug a few times is enough to scrape clean the contacts to then allow a solid, resistance free (practically speaking), mechanical connection. Now that you have inserted and removed a cable a couple times, the original cable may work just fine.
 
Okay, here's an update after a week of observations... I'm not sure it is the cable. It actually seems like the monitor is doing it. It switches to 30Hz not just after sleep, but after no signal for a few minutes. If I go into monitor settings and change input to hdmi (to which nothing is connected) and then back to DP, there are two Win7 boinks and back to 60Hz we are. What say you?
 
If I may add something to this discussion, if this is a PC I strongly suggest disabling sleep. Make sure the computer gets completely shut down every now and then. Sleep can add unneeded problems for you.
 
If I may add something to this discussion, if this is a PC I strongly suggest disabling sleep. Make sure the computer gets completely shut down every now and then. Sleep can add unneeded problems for you.
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Sorry Henry, but I disagree.

Years ago, with XP maybe but modern versions of Windows deal with the various sleep modes just fine - and this is especially true with current hardware which is specifically designed to support various sleep modes using modern versions of Windows.

The ATX Form Factor standard, for example, which has been around for years, requires all ATX compliant PSUs provide +5Vsb standby voltage to multiple points (including the RAM) on the motherboard when in standby mode. That is, any time the PSU is plugged in, and if so equipped, the master power switch on the back of the PSU is set to on. This standby voltage is what keeps your USB ports alive so you can press a key or wiggle your mouse to wake the computer when in sleep mode. DDR4 RAM is specifically designed to operate in a low voltage state to maintain data during sleep. Modern motherboards that support DDR4 are designed to take advantage of those modes so modern versions of Windows can wake faster, allowing users to much more quickly resume where they left off. A very good thing! And it works!

If you have a PC, I highly recommend using hybrid sleep mode (which is enabled by default on PCs). Hybrid sleep mode is combination of sleep and hibernate. In Hybrid sleep, the system saves any open documents and programs in memory running in a low voltage state, and it saves that data on the system disk too. Windows then suspends the computer into a low-power state, restoring the data upon waking.

However, should a power outage occur during that low voltage sleep mode, Windows will restore the last session using the hibernation data previously saved on the disk - with no data loss!

Note that Hybrid mode is not intended for notebooks and is disabled by default on notebooks. This is because on PCs, that +5Vsb voltage is still be applied in the various stand-by and sleep modes, therefore some power, while small, is still being consumed. That is not desired with battery operated devices.

If unneeded problems do occur, the proper solution is to find out what is causing those problems, and fix them!

Also, again while maybe true with XP, it is no longer true with modern versions of Windows (W7, W8, W10) that they need to be shutdown regularly. Just let them go to sleep. I only shutdown or reboot when some Windows or security update forces a reboot. That means I might go for weeks without shutting down my computers!

Contrary to what some may want us to believe, modern versions of Windows are very capable of properly managing its resources. There is no need to regularly reset everything with a reboot or shutdown and boot.

Disabling sleep (keeping computers fully awake) is just a waste of energy. And a full shutdown with power off can stop Windows from its normal housekeeping tasks it has scheduled while "we" sleep like indexing, defragging hard drives, and most importantly, installing critical updates.

If you want to regularly shut down your computer, that's fine. But understand Windows may then be forced to do more housekeeping and updating when you are using it - which can degrade performance, not optimize it.
 
1-2 years ago, certain programs and drivers had bugs that caused crashes or other stability issues in W8 and the early days of W10, and, if I remember correctly, a relatively small group of 850 evo SSD users were having issues with getting the system out of sleep due to an issue with the firmware.

This was then though, I haven't seen such problems with sleep mode in a long time.
 
1-2 years ago, certain programs and drivers had bugs that caused crashes or other stability issues in W8 and the early days of W10, and, if I remember correctly, a relatively small group of 850 evo SSD users were having issues with getting the system out of sleep due to an issue with the firmware.
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Drivers with bugs has been a problem since the beginning of drivers. And I suspect it will continue pretty much forever too.

I have an 850 Evo and 850 Pro SSD and didn't experience any problems with drivers causing sleep issues. However, what I did experience and saw others experiencing was problems with Samsung Magician, the SSD optimization program that came with those SSDs causing sleep issues - either failing to go to sleep, or failing to wake. Since Windows (at least W7 and newer) knows how to use and maintain SSDs just fine, the fix was to get rid of Samsung Magician since it is not needed anyway. IMO, the reason to install such 3rd party tools is to implement Secure Erase should you decide to get rid of the drive. Otherwise, don't waste your resources.
 
Drivers with bugs related to power states isn't common anymore, though it will probably return over time.

I could swear it was something related to the firmware of this particular SSD, but I could be wrong since it's been over a years and I can't find any thread back about it.
 
You could be right. I would not be surprised if there are not more than one "revisions" of that SSD model, like there are motherboard or hard drive model revisions. And I cannot say for sure the Samsung Magician's problem was not caused by a flaky driver either. All I know is my sleep problems and other users sleep problems with the 850 EVO and Pro series went away when Magician was uninstalled. And the drives worked fine (and mine are still working fine) otherwise afterwards too.
 

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