Graphics card stops system from booting

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Hey everybody, I've been experiencing some problems with the family computer and I'm hoping for some advice.

A few days ago the computer would not start when the case power button was pressed. I did the usual troubleshooting tests of resetting the cmos battery and removing everything from the motherboard except the cpu and RAM and slowly replacing everything one by one and trying to start again each time. The computer boots and runs without problem until I added the graphics card back in. I did different configurations of components with and without the graphics card to see if that might help, but it always knocks off when as the gpu is added.

I hooked up a new, larger psu (600w compared to the original 450w) to see if that made a difference but with no avail.

My questions are: Is there a way to definitely confirm that the graphics card is the problem? (I just don't want something more serious to be the cause.) Is it rare for a graphics card to just give up one day without much warning?

It's worth noting that the computer and graphics card are both rather old (mid/late 2009) and that I'm not very smart when it comes to this type of stuff.

I hope this is in the right forum and wasn't answered before. Thanks for any help!
 
I hooked up a new, larger psu (600w compared to the original 450w) to see if that made a difference but with no avail.

My questions are: Is there a way to definitely confirm that the graphics card is the problem?
Is it rare for a graphics card to just give up one day without much warning?
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Ensuring you have good power supplying your devices is one of the first steps in troubleshooting electronics. So, assuming you connected the 2nd PSU correctly (including any direct to card power connections, if your card requires one) and that the 2nd PSU is good, then we know it is not a PSU problem.

The only real definitive way to confirm that card is the problem is to try that card in another computer.

Typically, electronics hardware works perfectly for years, then suddenly fails when one component in the device, weakened by age, finally gives out and "opens" the circuit causing current to stop flowing, or the component "shorts" (creates an extreme drop in resistance), which causes current in the circuit, or an associated circuit to rapidly increase, which then immediately burns up some other component, opening the circuit. So yes, it is common for electronics to work fine almost forever, then suddenly give up with little to no warning.
 
Thanks for the replies guys. I've been busy with finals today.

I'm pretty certain the 600w power supply is good and I hooked it up correctly. I'll go about hooking the graphics card up to another computer some time this week. But actually the computer works just fine without the graphics card and no one really plays games on that computer any more, so I might just leave it out and install the drivers for the integrated graphics.

Wrench97 said:
What are the full specs of the system or if a major brand the brand and model of the PC?
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The pc is a HP p6130y with a BFG 450w psu replacement and a XFX Radeon 5750 gpu.

It was originally the family computer made so that it could do some light gaming on the side.
 
I'm pretty certain the 600w power supply is good
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Well, I personally don't feel "pretty certain" is conclusive enough for me - but that's the old electronics technician talking in me - I always want to be 100% certain I am supplying good, clean, stable power. That said, since the computer works fine with the integrated graphics, it is likely the PSU is good.

Fortunately, integrated graphics have come a long way in recent years. However, on most motherboards, integrated graphics still steals... err... "shares" system RAM for the GPU to use. So if performance is lagging with the integrated graphics, adding more RAM may provide the most bang for the buck and will not likely overtax your power supply.
 
Since he's tried 2 supplies(a 450w and a 650w) and it continued not to boot with the card installed chances are at least one of them would have been good, it's probably a failed card :)
 
Yeah, two supplies and the computer works without a graphics card. While I supposed it could be the motherboard, I agree it sounds like a bad card. But again, as noted earlier, to conclusively determine that, the card needs to go in another computer.
 
Hey thanks for the help guys. I plan on putting the graphics card into my other computer today or tomorrow to make 100% sure that it is the problem. I guess I was just skeptical to throw the card out at first.

I'm hoping the drop in performance by going to integrated graphics won't be a big deal. The computer is mostly used as a email-checker and photo storage nowadays. Now I just gotta go through the rigmarole of uninstalling the card drivers and installing the integrated drivers, but that's way better than replacing the motherboard or power supply.

Thanks again!
 
I plan on putting the graphics card into my other computer today or tomorrow to make 100% sure that it is the problem.
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In the interest of full disclosure, when troubleshooting electronics and using the swapping in and out method, there is always the risk a severely damaged part can damage or destroy whatever you put it into. Not cool! Not a big risk, but still possible. Plus, anytime you dig around inside a computer there is the risk of ESD damage, dropping a screwdriver, or damaging a slot or socket.

At least make sure you have a current backup of your important files on your other computer in the rare event something does go wrong.

I'm hoping the drop in performance by going to integrated graphics won't be a big deal. The computer is mostly used as a email-checker and photo storage nowadays.
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You may not even notice. The bigger (smaller?) most restrictive bottleneck when surfing the net and checking email will likely be your Internet connection. And for your photos, if on a hard drive, that will create a bottleneck there.

Watching videos is not demanding at all for integrated graphics. It is just handing off tasks. Virtually all µATX and ITX home theater computers (HTPCs) use integrated to PVR HD content and playing Blu-ray movies.

We don't know how much RAM you have, but if you do notice a performance drop, I would look at bumping up your RAM to 4G with 32-bit OS, or 8Gb with 64-bit OS.
Now I just gotta go through the rigmarole of uninstalling the card drivers and installing the integrated drivers, but that's way better than replacing the motherboard or power supply.
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If a newer version of Windows, it probably has the drivers for the integrated, and is already using them.
 
We don't know how much RAM you have, but if you do notice a performance drop, I would look at bumping up your RAM to 4G with 32-bit OS, or 8Gb with 64-bit OS.
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Sorry, I should have mentioned that it already has 8gb of ram, so hopefully that won't be a problem.

If a newer version of Windows, it probably has the drivers for the integrated, and is already using them.
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The pc is on Vista and it seems to have run fine as soon as it booted. Actually uninstalling the AMD drivers was much easier than I was expecting it to be. Now it's just a matter of letting the thing run and seeing if she's stable.
 
I've had three weird crashes with screen artifacts. Two crashes occurred during windows update, other occurred during normal use. Should I make another thread in the Crash/Bsod forums?
 
Wrench97 said:
Did it actually BSOD or just simple crash?

Follow the instructions here> https://www.sysnative.com/forums/bs...ctions-windows-8-1-8-7-and-windows-vista.html you can post the results in this thread to keep the continuity going.
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It was actually just a few simple crashes. I took the thing apart to see if there was anything obviously wrong and I noticed I hadn't plugged my HDD power cable in all the way :embarrasment5:

Replugged it and it's been going strong since then. I'd say at least 6 hours without any problems. Sorry!
 
I took the thing apart to see if there was anything obviously wrong and I noticed I hadn't plugged my HDD power cable in all the way
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It is not urgent but I recommend you shut it down again, unplug from the wall then closely inspect that power connection for evidence of arcing. Check the cable end first (because it is easy to unplug, bring out and inspect under a good light). It is not about damage (+12VDC is too small) but carbon build-up (soot marks). If you see any black or pitted arc marks on the cable connector, there likely is on the drive side too. Most power supplies have spare power cables (unless you have many drives installed). If me I would mark the cable and tie it out of the way, then use a different power cable.

Whether same or different cable, just [carefully] plugging and unplugging the connector 2 or 3 times should scrape the contacts clean to ensure a good "mechanical" connection - essential for a good "electrical" connection through the connector. The problem is, if not cleaned, dirt and carbon build-up in a connector promotes more build-up (and corrosion) which could lead to a bad power connection to the drive again.

Going in again will give you an opportunity to make sure all other power, data and fan cables are securely fastened, and routed, if possible out of the air flow through the case.

And make sure you discharge any static in your body by touching bare metal of the case interior before reaching in. And while in there, might as well make sure all the fans, heatsinks, vents, circuit boards are free of heat trapping dust - with you as the family go-to computer guy ;) no one else is going to for fear of messing it up.
 
]It is not urgent but I recommend you shut it down again, unplug from the wall then closely inspect that power connection for evidence of arcing. Check the cable end first (because it is easy to unplug, bring out and inspect under a good light). It is not about damage (+12VDC is too small) but carbon build-up (soot marks). If you see any black or pitted arc marks on the cable connector, there likely is on the drive side too. Most power supplies have spare power cables (unless you have many drives installed). If me I would mark the cable and tie it out of the way, then use a different power cable.

Whether same or different cable, just [carefully] plugging and unplugging the connector 2 or 3 times should scrape the contacts clean to ensure a good "mechanical" connection - essential for a good "electrical" connection through the connector. The problem is, if not cleaned, dirt and carbon build-up in a connector promotes more build-up (and corrosion) which could lead to a bad power connection to the drive again.

Going in again will give you an opportunity to make sure all other power, data and fan cables are securely fastened, and routed, if possible out of the air flow through the case.

And make sure you discharge any static in your body by touching bare metal of the case interior before reaching in. And while in there, might as well make sure all the fans, heatsinks, vents, circuit boards are free of heat trapping dust - with you as the family go-to computer guy ;) no one else is going to for fear of messing it up.
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Thanks for the tip! I probably wouldn't have thought to check the connections for damage. I think I mostly reseated all the other connections but I'll double check and I'll check for any damage on the connections when I get home.

For clearing of dust, do you have any special tips or tricks? I mostly just use a dry cloth and some compressed air.
 
The cloth would bother me because, depending on the material, it could build up a lot of static. And an ESD (electro static discharge) near a sensitive component, like CPUs, memory modules and other high density IC devices, could be very destructive.

I lug my systems out side and blast them with compressed air using a high-pressure nozzle. But you can only do that if your compressor has a suitable in-line moisture and particulate filter. Cans of compressed dusting gas and a soft, natural fiber brush will work, but not as good as an air compressor. I still recommend taking them outside rather than tossing the dust into the air again. I use a wooden Popsicle stick to hold the fans stationary while blasting. If the fans spin too fast, it can damage the bearings.
 
Wrench97 said:
Did it actually BSOD or just simple crash?

Follow the instructions here> https://www.sysnative.com/forums/bs...ctions-windows-8-1-8-7-and-windows-vista.html you can post the results in this thread to keep the continuity going.
Click to expand...

Well I came home to a blue screen today! Stop error 0x0000C1. Open up the pc and checked the connections like Digerati suggested, and started her back up. Ran a few minutes while I was trying to look deeper into the blue screen. Then another weird crash with screen artifacts all over the place. Gonna go run about a dozen runs of memtest86 and start a thread over in the crash forums.
 

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